Factory Farming

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Phee, Aug 22, 2007.

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  1. Phee

    Phee Moderator
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    If you don't know what Factory Farming (or Corporate Farming) is, look at these sites. The starred ones are the best and easiest to look at, as in not boring.:D

    ** http://www.themeatrix.com

    ** http://www.factoryfarming.com/

    http://www.factoryfarm.org/

    http://www.sustainabletable.org/issues/factoryfarming/

    http://www.hsus.org/farm/

    * http://www.hfa.org/factory/index.html

    http://www.idausa.org/facts/factoryfarmfacts.html

    That should be enough for any of you new to the horror factory farming. For more, you can always google it.


    Honestly, what are the downsides to stopping this? Why hasn't it been stopped yet? I can see no reason, other than that the price of meat and dairy might go up.
     
  2. SoC

    SoC Moderator
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    You pretty much said it all, the price of it all will go up.

    much less produce being made, where the supply is still the same. Meat is expensive as it is, any rise would then turn around in less people buying. and the farmers making less money. as bad as it seems, its needed for the country to run, we need cheap food and thats what they give us. Lots of families only just survive with their ££ as it is, any rise in meat would increase it and therefore make the poorer families get a less balanced diet, so when we look at it, factory farming is healthier than letting families get a less balanced diet.
     
  3. Phee

    Phee Moderator
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    In the short term, I suppose so, but in the long run, it's worse- mad cow disease, 'super-germs', animal cruelty to top it off.

    I can't say anything for the lesser income families because I personally am blessed to live a privileged life, but it just seems like the costs outweigh the benefits.
     
  4. Virre

    Virre Level IV

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    Well I stopped eating meat when I was 14, and I have no intention on quitting more than six years later so you can gueess where I stand in this topic :p
    There are just way too many arguments (animal ethics, health and enviromental) not to eat meat (both from hunting and factory farms).

    :lol:
    There's nothing hard about balancing a vegetarian or even a vegan diet.
    I've tested my blood to see if I have any problems with my health due to my vegan diet and I was as healthy as I could be =)
     
  5. SoC

    SoC Moderator
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    Isnt just meat tho, what bout milk prices, egg prices, cheese prices. all will increase if a farmer makes £0 via chickens or other animals. But the meat would be the most drastic increase in price
     
  6. Phee

    Phee Moderator
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    Veganism is great, but I can't even be a vegetarian- it's HARD! I've tried so many times it's pathetic. A friend of mine is vegan, but she has NEVER tasted meat or dairy in her entire life- her parents raised her like that. I wish I could've been so lucky.
     
  7. natskaya

    natskaya Level III

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    I think most people would rather have cheaper meat and stuff than they would worry about the welfare of animals. I feel guilty about it, but what is a normal person supposed to do about it? This kind of thing needs to be government regulated.
     
  8. Phee

    Phee Moderator
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    What can a normal person do about it?

    1)Buy organic dairy products and cage-free eggs.
    2)Tell your friends, your coworkers, everyone.
    3)Send an email or mail to companies like Starbucks, demanding that they use milk that is rBGH (artificial hormone) free.
    4)Contact your state representative and/or congressman and ask them to sponsor and/or propose bills against factory farming.
     
  9. Virre

    Virre Level IV

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    Well I never used economic as an argument for the stop of factory farms.
    However, one could argue that farmers would have to adept and use their land to actally grow vegtables on. If you converted the area currently used to raise cattle, you'd get much more vegtables and other plants than you get meat.
    Also, when people aren't available to buy meat at an affordable price, they choose to buy other food, which pretty much means that farmers won't lose their jobs at all. It's actually a very bad argument to use.
     
  10. Smelly

    Smelly Level IV

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    lol, you just managed to counter arguement your own arguement there!

    The thing is that people want (and need) meat. Everyone knows the whole dietary requirement thing so I won't bother going into it, but meat is part of it.

    Now just imagine if the farmers went and started growing veg on the land previously used for animals.
    1. Less animals.
    2. Less meat (duh!)
    3. Meat prices increase
    4. More veg
    5. Cheaper veg
    6. People start buying veg instead of meat because it's cheaper.
    7. People die from malnutrition.

    Get what i'm going for?

    Also the price per tonne of veg is way lower than the price per tonne of meat, and I would bet that the profit from sales of veg (after harvesting, and whatever they do) would be much less than that of meat (Cut cow, carve cow, sell!)

    So the farmers would be getting less money, the public will be dying from lack of meat and vegetables become sentient beings that take over the world!!!! :O

    An example of supply and demand in fooding. When the floods happened in the UK, price per pint (thats 0.57 litres) of milk went up by 3p ($0.06). That was in a week of diminished supplies...of MILK.

    Which is another thing harvested from cows. (Boy they are useful aren't they! Now only if you could grow carrots on them. It would be like a portable meal. A takeaway infact.)

    And to all the vegetarians out there (no offense) it has been shown that unless you stock up on other meat substitutes you do become malnourished. Humans are born omnivores. Personally, I think vegetarianism is much like getting a lion to enjoy a tasty plate of crisp salad. But then thats just one mans opinion.

    If people were serious about the whole ethics side of things, they would be vegans. (According to wiki, only 5% of US vegetarians consider themselves vegans.)

    But back to the subject. Factory farming.
    The only hangup I have with it is that animals might actually get hurt when being kept there.
    But then they get killed in the end anyway...so does it really, REALLY matter?
    Not enough for me to stop eating meat. Like I said, it's against human nature.

    As for the productivity side, its brilliant. 19p ($0.38) for 6 eggs is fantastic!
     
  11. Virre

    Virre Level IV

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    I'm having trouble understanding what you're trying to say.
    You mean that you can't get all nutrition you need from vegtables other plants?
    You know what, name whatever vitamin or protein that you're talking about and I'll tell you how you can get it from somewhere else than animals. Try it. =)
    I mean, how do you people survived through the middle ages? Many people didn't even have access to cattle.

    And for your other argument, that prices would only go down, well that's not true either.
    When people can't buy meat, they'll buy vegetables/beans/etc. instead, and this will keep the prices up. People don't just stop eating because they can't get meat/milk/eggs.
    Also, the areal that is now used for getting food to the animals in order to make them become fatter and yummier would be used to grow other things. This way you wouldn't have to spend all that food on the animals, but could get it straight to humans. It is estimated that you would get 10x more energy by skipping the middleman (cattle). This would also open up for domestic markets, the brasilians would actually be able to eat the soy beans they grow in their own country (yay!), instead of having to ship it to other countries.

    As for humans being born as omnivores, our round teeth and long intestines is belived to show that we mostly have been eating vegetables. The animal which our anatomy is most similar to, the gorilla, eats only vegetables. It is also belived that humans didn't start to eat meat until just 40,000-50,000 years ago, and that the big consumption of meat didn't occur until the industrial revolution.

    Please do some research before coming with arguments you have only heard other repeat. :p
     
  12. Phee

    Phee Moderator
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    I think that's possibly the most inhumane thing I've ever read.

    We, as humans, die anyways, so does it REALLY matter what kind of lives we lead? Whether we're happy, or fed, or clothed, or healthy?

    Animals aren't things, they're beings, just like you and me. They breathe, they eat, they feel.
     
  13. Commy

    Commy Moderator
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    Well, factory farming is being phased out of major meat producing companies, which is a good thing. Also, I heard an interesting fact: If we all became vegeatarians, and instead of animal farms and grazing fields we planted vegetables, we could end world hunger.
     
  14. Phee

    Phee Moderator
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    Call me when the whole world turns vegetarian. :D
     
  15. SoC

    SoC Moderator
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    Another thing your forgetting is the type of land, and soil.

    You need flat level fertile soil to grow veg, whereas u can raise cows/sheep in hills or anywhere. So these farmers wouldnt be able to swap to veg growing.
     
  16. Commy

    Commy Moderator
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    You don't need flat soil to grow vegetables.
    [​IMG]
    Here's an example of vegetables being grown in a hilly area, and has been in wide practice for centuries.
    Also, cows and sheep emit methane. In Australia alone, it's 140 million sheep and cattle are estimated to produce one seventh of the worlds total greenhouse gas emissions, contributing to global warming. Oh yeah, that isn't counting America's 100 million cattle.

    It's funny when you say farmers wouldn't be able to swap to vegetable growing, because most of the pasture land that exists was originally converted into that. The conversion of natural environment to pasture land has threatened native plants and animals world wide. An example of this is the rain forests in Brazil being cut down for cattle grazing. Pasture land for cattle is the largest use for agricultural land. Now if we converted all these pastures into vegetable fields, there would be a lot more food. On top of that, such crops as legumes and grains are being fed to cattle, and a large part of that too.

    So I say in theory, there would be a lot more food if we all went vegetarian, but I suppose that's a lot of trouble. And we love our meat.
     
  17. SoC

    SoC Moderator
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    converting to terracing to grow plants and stuff will also cost more money, and as its been said meat > vedge for money. 1 cow wud be worth 100 carrots or something stupid :p
     
  18. Commy

    Commy Moderator
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    1 cow might be worth 100 carrots, but the costs to raise that one cow is over $1900.
    and let's say carrots cost $1 per carrot, that's still over 1900 carrots.

    You also ignored the fact that most of agricultural land is used for grazing, not farming. That is flat land. Which would not need to be converted into terrace. Overall it would be cheaper to grow vegetables instead of raising cattle.

    I'm not sure what the cost of growing vegetables on a hill would cost, but you mentioned in a previous post that it was not possible. Which it is. Even if it was expensive, it is for the long run. You can continue to grow vegetables on that hill. Whereas, once you've eaten the cow, it's gone.
     
  19. punkeydew

    punkeydew Level IV

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    I am deeply saddened that this happens... But I would never go as far as becoming a vegitarian... I really do love meat...My blood type it O+ most people with O blood types need meat to survive. Though I do buy my meat from co ops and local farms. Where I can actually see the cows out at pasture and watch the chickens cluck around the farm.

    I do not agree on buying mass produced meat.

    same goes for fruits and veggies!

    BUY LOCAL!!!

    see if your city or town has a local farmers market :D
     
  20. Smelly

    Smelly Level IV

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    True. I wasn't trying to say that it doesn't matter, although thats what came out.
    The point is kind of messed up in my head, and i've never been good at putting my thoughts down.
    I'm not really sure what I even meant. It might have been along the lines of the fact they are reared in order to be consumed by humans.

    Thats slightly unfair. They were entirely my opinions, and even if they aren't the strongest of arguements I'd like to think I'm able to think by myself without having to rip the ideas off other people.
     
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