We probably all believe that for anything that happens, there has to be something that caused it. So for instance I was late to school because my alarm clock ran out of battery. I didn't swap the battery because my alarm clock has no mechanism which tells me that my alarm clock is low on battery or whatever. So everything that happens, happens because of something that already exists. Of course we can't overview why something happens, but we know that it happens because of something else. So like that everything would be predetermined, just as well as the fact that I'm writhing this is due to many reasons. So lets start with something like Big Bang. Because Big Bang happened (if that actually happened is another debate) some other things happened, leading up to our existence. But wasn't it all predetermined? If so, everything we do would be predetermined. I think this sounds totally logical. What do you think?
Re: Is everything deteminated? Nothing can be determined but things can occur because of the influence of the environment. the alarm clock not going off because of low battery only affects you so therefore it seems like things are determined when you simplify it to your day and how it plays out.. what im trying to say is that .. first comes influence. then reactions to those influences happen. then the consequences good or bad .. then adaption. life itself is random so therefore is not determined... If it was determined we could find out what will happen and when.. One event can influence another event or actions the ramifications may be gave or nothing can happen at all. IMO
Re: Is everything deteminated? Well lets talk about randomness... The manifestation of radomness is often a cube. Do you think it is totally random what the cubue will fall on or do you think it depends on how strong you throw it, spin, angle, material of the ground it falls on... and so on. We can't see how the cube will fall, we don't even know why but we can presume that the given influences lead to a certain result. I think that a thing just seems random, I think the thing itself is not random at all, we are just not capabl to see the influences. I think that to any given event you can find a chain of causation, if thats true the logical consequnece would be that everything is determined.
Re: Is everything deteminated? I definately do not believe that everything is determinated. I dont believe that anything is determinated, actually. yeah, things occour that may seem like it's not just random, but it is :'D I agree with Ak* that everything influence everything . I dont really see your point, sorry. I mean, do you believe that God is deciding everything? Or that it's destiny or something?
Re: Is everything deteminated? From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Determinism Maybe that makes my point a little clearer... I guess you could call it destiny, but it's not something that you say because you're religious... It is a logical consequence.
Re: Is everything deteminated? I sounds interesting, but I just dont see how it could be possible. Maybe because I really rely all my thoughts about the universe and such on science :b Btw, beautiful name.. Heehe.
Re: Is everything deteminated? Yeah and I choose it beofore I saw your name I rely all my thoughts on science as well... Would really love to believe in God or whatever... But sadly I can't... Most of the people I have talked to about this idea think that it sounds logical usually the religious ones disagree
NoI don't think so of its how you are asking, but I do believe everything happens for a reason being good or bad but not predetermined. That's my long pointless thought turned short lol
Well before this debate turns into... Is there a God Scenario... we must look at the science of the world.. nothing in my view is predetermined. if it was life would be easy. The ice age for example was the direct result of th Earth needing to cool down its core temperature. it happened through random events and there is no way a higher being could constitute these events or even make it happen. religion to me is a way to explain these random events (thats a whole nother debate in itself.) as we look at question we cant answer people turn to religion as sort of a comfort food.
i don't think that everything is predetermined. I do think you are the key to those actions. You chose those things. You could like not go to school because you choose not too. And while you don't go to school there was a fire for example. Those things can't be measured. The only thing you should do is ; nothing. Plain simple because i think you can get totally mad about thinking about something you dont know anything about and probably will never know.
Once again, it has absoloutly nothing to do with a higher entity of some sort... Well, why do you make a choice? Do you think that your choices are random, or could you tell my why you made your choice? Yes you are the one who makest this choice, but if I knew everything that influenced you in whatever way and would know how strong this influences are and if I had the brain capacity to do all that. Couldn't I predict your behaviour? I like to simplify things here because like that it seems understandable. Lets take bowling, you can build a machine which will hit a strike every time, because if you hit the pins at a certain spot, with a certain speed and a certain spin all pins will fall down. Actually if I'd know the speed of a bowling ball, where it hits and with which weight, spin and so on. I could tell you how many pins will fall down. I think this seems probable so far. Now, is it pretedetermined what score I will hit before I throw? Honestly I can't list every faktor that influences the result, but I think that if I knew all of them and if I could weight them correctly I could predict the score even before the Person has thrown the ball. I think a lot of things seem random, but they are just like that because there are too many influneces for us to predict what will happen or even to say afterwards why it happened... This counts for everything that happens in the Universe if you believe in the cause-and-effect chain. If you belive that everything happens because of the causations then you have to ask what caused the causations and so on. Why am I typing this text? Now I could give you a lot of causations to why I'm typing this text, lets start with "because I was born" why was I born "because my parents met some day". There are a whole lot of other reasons, and they exist because of other reasons. Know if everything happens because of something given couldn't we predict the future if we would know everything about the "now"? I think it's just like a domino chain, and we are somewhere in the middle of this, everything causes something else. Just like my post now will cause somebody to answer. Now the next step would be... If everything is determined, I'm not resposible for my actions... You can say that if you want to, to me it seems totally logical, but you know you'll still end up in prison
I think that way too. For me, everything happens for a reason. If your alarm clock didn't ring, there is reason, even if it seems random. I do think everything is predeterminated.
Yes it completly does... That is just a point were people say that they can't believe in this. I don't know if I have a free will and I don't really care... If I wouldn't I couldn't change it.
If you think too much of it then...we can ask Max : Max: Look Sam, scientists running in packs. I had no idea nerds were herding animals. I'll edit this when I got time :yup:
If everything was predetermined then i'd hate to be the guy that does it since even a slight thing like you not setting your alarm affects everyone in the world.. You miss the bus your best friend sits and chats with someone else they tell a joke to each other find it funny tell other people and so on... You not being on the bus means one less stop it gets there 1 minute sooner and on the way misses somneone who would have just made it if you was on time thanks to your one minute delay? I dunno i doubt everything is predetermined maybe the big things are but no way the littel as one small change in your life is many changes for everyone.,.. I think?
There is no real point to this argument. If a person says "you're not predetermined to do anything", another person can say "you were destined to say that." Arguments like this is like trying to determine which color is best. It's all about what people are willing to believe. As for what I'm willing to believe - Nothing is predetermined. Life is like a box of chocolates.