My assignment : Hate the sin love the sinner.

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by soccermadness90, Oct 14, 2007.

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  1. soccermadness90

    soccermadness90 Level III

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    Should we forgive the sinner no matter what crime he or she does?
     
  2. goncalo

    goncalo Level IV

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    I guess it depends on the kind of sin.
    I think that people who do some type of mistake for the first time, and are not aware of the consequences should be forgiven. Everyone deserves a second oppurtinity and in some cases, this opportunity might change this person to a much better one that he/she was before. If this same people made the same 'sin' for a second/third/... time, it should be punished in my opinion.
    If you're talking about the Holy sins, and not about someone who did something bad at the school/work, than those are more serious. I think those are more related to each one's personality and harder to make someone change it.
     
  3. bunnah

    bunnah Level III

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    it depends.... what kind of sin are we talkin about here?? some things can be forgivin others can not...
     
  4. Commy

    Commy Moderator
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    You would also have to take into account if they were remorseful or not. I mean, the Bali bombers were actually happy with what they did, believing that they were killing infidels who were going to hell anyway. They only sorry for the muslims that they killed. Their smiling faces get to me, they're dying proud as martyrs in their eyes.
    I can't forgive that
     
  5. Virre

    Virre Level IV

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    Yes, otherwise our punishments would be focused only on revenge, and not on rehabilitation.
     
  6. mash

    mash Level II

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    it depends really, for example im not religious and i certainly dont believe in an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth but i do believe that forgiveness is a much harder and more noble thing to do than anything else, especially for a really bad crime.

    i think if i were to have something terrible done to me though (eg rape etc) then i would never be able to forgive because the people that do things like that are cold hearted and dont really deserve forgiveness, i promise you i wouldnt pee on them if they were on fire anyway!

    but on the other hand if someone did something out of sheer desperation then yes, i do believe in forgiveness.

    god i talk so much bull sometimes lol!!!!
     
  7. K1TT3N

    K1TT3N Level I

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    It really depends what the sin is.

    Generally if theyve taken someones life away then its unforgiveable.
     
  8. soccermadness90

    soccermadness90 Level III

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    i never thought of it that way before. Nice!

    punishments should be for making the person realising ones mistakes and not for revenge and if you do not forgive than punishment would not be good at all. because i do not believe in revenge. Revenge is a vicious cycle and it would only bring harm.
     
  9. cardenal

    cardenal Level III

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    of course there are always extenuating circumstances...

    think about the two little boys that murdered a toddler. they were only about 8 or 9. Did they know what they were doing? The Mormons believe that you only learn the difference between right and wrong at the age of 8.
    If they know what they did was wrong, but they did it anyway, should you forgive them?
    if they didn't know what they did was wrong, and it was all "innocent", should they be forgiven? Will the mother of that toddler ever forgive them?

    And, euthenasia is still considered murder. Can you forgive someone that euthenises a suffering relative? What about a father that euthenises his daughter?
    What about switching off life-support machines? Thats murder, because you're taking away someones life
     
  10. Commy

    Commy Moderator
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    Should they be forgiven if what they believe they are doing is right? Some people believe that killing others who arent in their religion is right, and the will of their God. Should we forgive them? Who do not feel remorse?
     
  11. Virre

    Virre Level IV

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    We should, because if they truly belive that they are killing for some greater good, they are delirious and can not be blamed for what they have done.
     
  12. noncheatercheater

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  13. Commy

    Commy Moderator
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    They could be perfectly sane, just people who are devout in their faith.
    Here's an article about the Bali bombings that happened a few years ago.
    http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/ ... 25238.html
    We should still forgive them even though they are happy for the deaths they've caused? For all the lives they've affected? And they still feel no remorse? Amrozi, one of the conspirators behind the bombing, dubbed as the "Smiling Assassin" due to his always gleeful expression, was only sorry that most of the Westerners that died were Australians, and not Americans.
    I can forgive Ali Imron, but the varied reactions shows that the bombers aren't delirious. They are aware of what they have done, and people like that I don't think deserve forgiveness.
     
  14. soccermadness90

    soccermadness90 Level III

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    i agree that we cannot forgive such atrocious murders. People without remorse for the wrongs that they have done do not deserve pity nor do they deserve forgiveness.
    However i still do believe that sinners deserve a chance to change for the better. but if they do not take the chance as in the case of the "Smiling Assassin" we should get rid of them as they will only cause harm to our society.
     
  15. chikorita_S

    chikorita_S Level I

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    I think we should forgive ALL people no matter what they did or done, Because if this 8 year old kept biting this 11 year old deeply? and the 11 year old died, I think the kid should be forgiven.
     
  16. Virre

    Virre Level IV

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    I belive that when you are that so devoted to a religion that you can kill for it, you have crossed the line of being a sane person.
    Just because you are aware of what you done doesn't mean that you're sane.
     
  17. noncheatercheater

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    Same goes if your that devoted to ANYTHING.
     
  18. Commy

    Commy Moderator
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    No it doesn't mean that they're sane, but the Merriam-Webster dictionary defines insanity as a deranged state of the mind or lack of understanding. I don't think those bombers were in a deranged state of mind. They were taught certain things about their religion, and had the choice to believe it. They did not have a lack of understanding about what they were doing. I don't believe that just because they are devoted to their religion then that excludes them from blame. You can't use that as an excuse for what happened, nor would pleading 'insanity' in those cases work in court.
    Is there any purpose to forgive people like that? They neither asked for it, nor do they deserve it, taking pleasure in the suffering they have caused.
     
  19. Virre

    Virre Level IV

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    I'm not using the word sane as in opposite of insane, but rather as a synonym to reasonable (/sensible) (according to swedish-english lexicons). A person does not have to be insane to make an unreasonable decision, but making such a decision based on faith is not something that should be blamed on them, since it probably has some kind of background (hate for the West due to various possible reasons).

    And yes, there is a point of forgiving people like that. Not for their sake, but for your own. Having that said, I'm not talking about releasing people from jail just because they are forgiven, they might still be a hazard for the society.
     
  20. Commy

    Commy Moderator
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    Their actions weren't reasonable. And I do think that they should be blamed on what they have done, not on their religion or background. The majority of Muslims (that was the religion that Amrozi followed) do not to go to such extreme lengths. Maybe they were exposed to things in their background that led them to that decision, but it was their decision to choose to do it, and so I don't think they should be excluded from blame. Just blaming their actions on their devotion to their faith doesn't seem reasonable to me, especially when most of the Muslim leaders themselves do not condone such bombings, and have signed declarations stating such.
     
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